Dumbledore's death, a ruse? *theory discussion*

[Kalessin]

Firstly, there are a few things with Dumbledore's death that just don't quite fit:

1. Why did Dumbledore freeze Harry instead of them both fighting their way out which they could have done?
2. I doubt that Dumbledore's powers would have been limited to the use of a wand if he had wanted to start fighting.
3. Dumbledore trusted Snape deeply, why didn't he forsee this happening?

Well, what if Dumbledore thought he could be of more use to the war with Voldemort thinking him dead? I mean, lets not forget that earlier in the book, Hagrid mentioned Snape and Dumbledore arguing and telling Snape that he had promised to do it (we not knowing what it is). Surely, Snape could have had reservations against a dangerous ruse involving the headmaster's life?

Also, if Dumbledore wasn't dead, think of all he could do for the war without his headmaster position restricting him, without the ministry hounding him and without Voldemort knowing of him! Plus, Harry is woefully magically inept and he will need some magical aptitude to beat Voldemort eh... something I was dissapointed didn't really improve in book 6.

What do you think?

[Bergdorfblonde]

I think Dumbledore freezed Harry because he didn't want Harry to be hurt or captured by the Death Eaters. I mean Harry is a sixteen year old wizard :he wouldn't really help Dumbledore who is the most powerful wizard in the world with Voldy. But I think your theory is good: we didn't see Dumbledore s body but just a blanket.

[Kalessin]

Yeah, also though, Snape left Harry, saying he was to be left for Voldemort - therefore Snape didn't try to take Harry for Voldemort or to kill him which brings his loyalties into question again.

The thing that brought this theory on though especially is thta Dumbledore and Snape were overheard arguing about something and we don't know what - this theory is my answer to that, though I'm interested if anyone else has any possible answers?

I guess I'm in ultimate shock n depression of Dumbledore's death, hmm, hope he still lives...

[DumbledoreistheMaster]

I think he froze Harry because he knew that would do anything for him including sacrificing his own life. Especially after being down in the cave and all the times Harry tried to do things so Dumbledore wouldn't have to like using his own blood to get into the cave and drink the potion instead of Dumbledore. It wold be very interesting if Dumbledore isn't really dead and it would be helpful but how do you explain the picture in his office?

[Stumpy]

But at the time when he did it, it was only Malfoy! then it was only another 4 DE which you presume dumbledore would be able to take even in a weakened state with Harry by his side. Its not as if Harry hasnt been comfronted by them before! this makes me think DD was trying to convince Malfoy not to do it to bring him back over to the good side, and he new harry would emediately attack malfoy due to his distrust of him. So he froze Harry so he could negotiate without having to deal with Harry's interference!

[Augusta Longbottom]

I think it's fairly certain that DD is dead -- as mentioned above, the Headmaster picture frame that appeared in the headmaster's office. BUT, I do think all these other things mentioned are worthy of consideration about WHY DD died.

There is so much more to why DD died than just "well Snape killed him". The converstation between Snape and DD could have been about DD insisting Snape would have to do this. Then when HP and DD returned from the cave, DD insisted on seeing Snape rather than Madam Pomfrey. Madam Pomfrey would have done everything in her power to save DD, while Snape and DD may have had an agreement that Snape would end DD's life for the greater good. There is a section in HBP where DD asks HP to agree to a series of questions before they head out to the cave...DD had possibly done the same thing with Snape to insure that Snape would actually end his life when it became necessary.

I think it was necessary for DD to die (in his eyes at least) for the sake of Draco. I think DD would do anything he had to for the sake of a students well-being, especially since DD must have his hunches that Voldemort only made Draco a death eater to get revenge upon his Lucius.

[Dacre]

I recon the death is faked - but I admit this is what I want to believe.
I am at least sure that DD just died in such a foolish way that he must have set it up.

[werebane]

I do think that DD is dead. while i dont want him to be, i thnk that is the truth.

There is no way to survive avada kedavra. Harry is the Special exeption, but DD didnt have protection like harry did

[daisymae]

Snape is the one who is going to kill Voldemort...not Harry...Dumbledore made him promise to murder him so that Snape can put a part of his soul in a (whatever) and then not die when facing Voldemort...

this explains why Dumbledore was *pleading* with Snape...he wasn't pleading w/Snape not to kill him..but instead he was pleading w/Snape to do what he had promised...to kill Dumbledore.

Now that we know Snape is a *half blood* this sets up the whole thing..

as for the prophecy "either must die die at the hand of the other for neither can live while the other survives"... Harry could be the one who *kills* the last bit of Voldemorts saved soul and then Snape kills Voldemort...

I think Dumbledore is dead but it is possible that as long as his body doesn't leave Hogwarts he can *come back to life* at Hogwarts, and Snape is the one who can do this..if Snape survives...but that he will never be able to leave Hogwarts again...

[xXxFawkesSong]

1. Why did Dumbledore freeze Harry instead of them both fighting their way out which they could have done?

Dumbledore knew Harry would try to save him. I don't think Harry would have died if he hadn't been frozen, but he might have been able to stop Snape from escaping. I think Snape might still be good, and had to do the unbreakable vow (which Dumbledore knew about).

2. I doubt that Dumbledore's powers would have been limited to the use of a wand if he had wanted to start fighting.

Maybe Snape is still good? Dumbledore knew Snape had to kill him. Perhaps Snape is going to help Harry kill Voldie? I don't know, my theories are really dumb =o

3. Dumbledore trusted Snape deeply, why didn't he forsee this happening?

Perhaps he did know?

I think Dumbledore is dead for good.

[sweetassugar555]

i do not think that snape is good at all but i have this weird feeling that dumbledore is still alive, i dont know what it is...

[gadfly22]

I don't know if I think Dumbledore is really dead or not, but a couple of points:

1. Dumbledore and Harry's trip to the horcrux reminded me a lot of a scene in the movie "Dragonslayer", which involved a lake of fire instead of a lake of inferi. But the defeat of the dragon in that movie was brought about by the wizard's willing death. In fact, he had to call out to his apprentice to carry out his instructions to kill him. Feels like much the same dynamic here -- Snape being forced to kill (or seem to kill) Dumbledore in order to further Dumbledore's plans.

2. Much was made of the ability to case spells silently in HBP. Although Snape spoke the Avedra Kedavra curse, he may have been thinking some offsetting protection for Dumbledore. Or Dumbledore might.

3. I think Snape is still in fact a double agent, acting for Dumbledore. And I think that he will end up sacrificing his life by breaking his vow to keep Malfoy safe in order to carry out Dumbledore's plans and thwart Voldemort.

[Imelyen]

There is no way to survive avada kedavra. Harry is the Special exeption, but DD didnt have protection like harry did

True...But the imposter-moody said in the forth book that it takes quite a bit of power to do the spell to its fullest potential...If Snape only put enough power behind his spell to knock Dumbledore from the tower (and relying on him to do some wand-less magic to save himself) that would have convinced everyone the Dumbledore was dead (I know, i know, it's a very very very long shot)

[thestral]

but the phoenix song, the portrait. i think that DD is undoubtedly dead.

[Imelyen]

Yea, I have to say I agree, though it's not like we wont be hearing from him in the 7th book